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pluralLet me start by saying this is entirely theoretical although it was sparked by real life discussions
and it has been bouncing around in my head for sometime
shall we start with some background
I have many female friends in fact I can count my male friends on my fingers
while my close female friends alone would require toes
for the most part I have little tolerance for men, the ego and bullshit
and quite frankly while most of my female friends
are just that, friends
[i.e. pants I am not trying to get into]
they still are a lot more pleasant to look at
the older I get, the more I realize, the part this plays in my friendships
[this is a realization, not an actual increase]
the vast majority of my friends are highly attractive women
a good number of them are women who I have dated or slept with
[and some I still sleep with on occasion]
but with whom romance wasn't in the stars
I have on previous occasions commented on my tendency to choose
attractive females to serve my needs in professional areas.
My broker, attorney and accountant are all female [and attractive]
as were my real estate agent, dentist and doctors when I had need for such
now they are all highly competent, I would not choose tits over competence
but I must admit that when choosing between two equally competent individuals
the tit factor will often come into play
so enough about me and back to the situation at hand
many, if not most of these female friends and I
[this does not include my professional relationships]
flirt, often incorrigibly
it is casual fun and amusement and with a few of them
there is a running joke concerning getting married
to be clear in these cases these are either women whom
I am not interested in dating
[and who are quite clear on my position]
or women who I have no or almost no real life context with
by which to even base the most whimsical flight of fancy upon
the situation in question here concerns one of the latter
a woman, (not a girl) with whom I enjoy interacting
a woman who I respect both for her accomplishments and for her perspective on life
I want to be extremely clear on this
I have no feelings for her beyond the affection
one would have with someone
whom one has shared many laughs and even a few tears
however romantic I maybe from time to time, I do not believe in love at first sight
and I have learned to guard my heart carefully especially in situations
where there is little opportunity to do more than pine
I also do not believe in true love for me love is a function of trust, time, affection, concern and sharing
and of course
specifically with romantic love
attraction
I love a great many people but not romantically
The difference I think between those women I love as friends and those women I have loved romantically
is governed by two things one is that mischievous spark of attraction which can never be counted on to spark
except when you least expect it
and practicality
how practical is a relationship between the two of you
both in time, space, and ideals
There are many women, whom I am attracted to on various levels
but with whom a relationship would not work, for a variety of reasons
primarily lifestyle or beliefs
the practicality part explains how I can still love
many if not most of my ex-girlfriends just not romantically
I have learned that contrary to our societies love mythos that love does not always conquer all
I believe it can, providing both people are willing to make it the priority
but without that resolve love can be easily and often conquered by the smallest every day events
With that in mind I long ago realized that,
I could fall in love with nearly any woman I was attracted to
if I let myself but I do not
I have an image in my mind of what sort of woman I want to be in love with and it is no small feat to measure up there
in the interest of simplicity, I would say I want a woman,
with a brilliant mind, an open heart, an adventurous spirit, and who is hot damn attractive
now this friend in question is one of the small number of women
I know who appear to meet my criteria but with whom attempting a relationship is impractical
[in her specific case, space is the primary impracticality]
and she also happens to be one of those with whom, marriage is a running joke.
Do I love her, no
Do I have a crush on her, no
but I am amused by her, feel some affection for her, and enjoy her company
Anyway
In a recent discussion, she told me that she has herpes
and out of respect for her privacy I will not get into details beyond saying that in my opinion,
her contracting the virus was due to the malicious neglect of another rather than her own carelessness
We had a really great conversation about it, She was quite open and willing to answer a barrage of questions which came to my mind and for the purposes of the question I am going to put to you, it is also important that I say that she is quite responsible about being aware of her condition, and educating herself on the risks and circumstances and beyond that takes the responsibility to communicated proactively with potential partners.
i.e. she is being responsible in dealing with her situation and moving on with her life
and that I respect a lot, for too many people fail that test.
so after talking with her, I thought about it quite a bit and tried to imagine how that would affect me.
I have always been fairly terrified of STDs, I have been tested every six months since I was 14
so my first thoughts were fairly centered on how contracting such a virus would affect me
I have never even had a cold sore, let alone any other STD
hell, I haven't had mono, pink eye or almost any communicable condition
save chicken pox
I have pretty much always been absolutely healthy
and stayed away from anyone who could give me anything beyond
the common cold or a case of the flu
but then it occurred to me
What would I do if faced with the following situation:
A woman I meet, whom I am highly attracted to and who I greatly respect, a woman who appears to meet my criteria but who informs me she has herpes.
These days herpes is a highly manageable condition, in fact it is theoretically possible to have a relationship with a carrier
without contracting the virus, provided both people are proactive and aware
but theory, risk and reality are very different markers
but what about risk, I take risks all the time, and have often risked life and limb for far less lofty a concept as love
I like to tell myself they are calculated risks, but would this not also be calculated?
and am I lying to myself anyway trying to convince myself that my calculated risks are any less risky?
My first thought was perhaps the risk is worth is for love but not for lust or perhaps a better way to phrase it
would be I wouldn't sleep with a carrier just to get laid but that if marriage was a potential, I wouldn't throw the babe out with the bath water
because if I am never going to have sex with someone else the question of such a disease is fairly moot
really with something like herpes what are the effects
the symptoms are manageable and the primary disruptions to your life
are with potentially infecting someone else and the social stigma attracted to it
if you were married neither would matter much
the next question which came up was of premarital sex if you have sex with a carrier before you are married
how is that any different than sex for lust after all, intending to get married and getting married are two different things
so that lead me to a position of no premarital sex
but still not throwing the baby out with the bath water
I mean if this person is someone I could have a meaningful life with
a person who shares my values and perspectives on things
how much does something like herpes weigh in on that question
in a married situation it seems to hardly matter
in a single situation it seems to weigh quite heavily
of course the idea of getting married without having sex first
seems a little antiquated for me
but then we move to the question of divorce
while I have no intention of getting divorced
I would be a fool not to realize that it is always a possibility
our society's divorces rates are too high to dismiss so casually
especially considering one is risking a permanent condition
and even if you discard divorce
there is always the possibility that your spouse might die
the question comes down to weight
what weighs more
the chance that you might have a loving and wonderful relationship for the rest of your life
or
the chance that you might at some point be single and with a communicable disease
Part of me, wants to say, it depends on the girl
the romantic in me wants to say that for the right woman
I would throw my cares away and conquer the world
and in many ways that is true
the cynic in me however is never silent
it put the weight in the other corner
and
reminds me that I do not think my pride could handle
having to explain to a person who I was romantically interested
that I had a communicable disease
It is one of those choices
where when I try on either position
to see how it feels
neither feels entirely comfortable
I can not abide the idea that I would let such a woman slip through my fingers for anything unrelated to who she is
but at the same time, I am not sure I could be comfortable with the risks either
I suppose what it comes down to is that it is one of those choices
which we are unable to make until we are actually in the situation
so I guess I will have to let this dentate lie unresolved
unless a situation occurs where I have to find a peace with it
If you have gotten this far, I applaud your stamina and ask you
What would you do?
How would you approach such a situation?
I debated making a post about this for some time
partly because it was so abstract but I figured how I approach such a question
says as much about me as whatever answer I do or do not find
and that approach, that process is as much what I am sharing here as anything else
Lastly, a select few of your may have the ability to discern the identity of the person in question,
by piecing together other pieces of information which I have shared with you.
Out of respect for their privacy, and considering this post is not really about them,
even though they sparked the many of the thoughts I would appreciate your discretion as to their identity.
and that's my nickel
use it as you see fit
and it has been bouncing around in my head for sometime
shall we start with some background
I have many female friends in fact I can count my male friends on my fingers
while my close female friends alone would require toes
for the most part I have little tolerance for men, the ego and bullshit
and quite frankly while most of my female friends
are just that, friends
[i.e. pants I am not trying to get into]
they still are a lot more pleasant to look at
the older I get, the more I realize, the part this plays in my friendships
[this is a realization, not an actual increase]
the vast majority of my friends are highly attractive women
a good number of them are women who I have dated or slept with
[and some I still sleep with on occasion]
but with whom romance wasn't in the stars
I have on previous occasions commented on my tendency to choose
attractive females to serve my needs in professional areas.
My broker, attorney and accountant are all female [and attractive]
as were my real estate agent, dentist and doctors when I had need for such
now they are all highly competent, I would not choose tits over competence
but I must admit that when choosing between two equally competent individuals
the tit factor will often come into play
so enough about me and back to the situation at hand
many, if not most of these female friends and I
[this does not include my professional relationships]
flirt, often incorrigibly
it is casual fun and amusement and with a few of them
there is a running joke concerning getting married
to be clear in these cases these are either women whom
I am not interested in dating
[and who are quite clear on my position]
or women who I have no or almost no real life context with
by which to even base the most whimsical flight of fancy upon
the situation in question here concerns one of the latter
a woman, (not a girl) with whom I enjoy interacting
a woman who I respect both for her accomplishments and for her perspective on life
I want to be extremely clear on this
I have no feelings for her beyond the affection
one would have with someone
whom one has shared many laughs and even a few tears
however romantic I maybe from time to time, I do not believe in love at first sight
and I have learned to guard my heart carefully especially in situations
where there is little opportunity to do more than pine
I also do not believe in true love for me love is a function of trust, time, affection, concern and sharing
and of course
specifically with romantic love
attraction
I love a great many people but not romantically
The difference I think between those women I love as friends and those women I have loved romantically
is governed by two things one is that mischievous spark of attraction which can never be counted on to spark
except when you least expect it
and practicality
how practical is a relationship between the two of you
both in time, space, and ideals
There are many women, whom I am attracted to on various levels
but with whom a relationship would not work, for a variety of reasons
primarily lifestyle or beliefs
the practicality part explains how I can still love
many if not most of my ex-girlfriends just not romantically
I have learned that contrary to our societies love mythos that love does not always conquer all
I believe it can, providing both people are willing to make it the priority
but without that resolve love can be easily and often conquered by the smallest every day events
With that in mind I long ago realized that,
I could fall in love with nearly any woman I was attracted to
if I let myself but I do not
I have an image in my mind of what sort of woman I want to be in love with and it is no small feat to measure up there
in the interest of simplicity, I would say I want a woman,
with a brilliant mind, an open heart, an adventurous spirit, and who is hot damn attractive
now this friend in question is one of the small number of women
I know who appear to meet my criteria but with whom attempting a relationship is impractical
[in her specific case, space is the primary impracticality]
and she also happens to be one of those with whom, marriage is a running joke.
Do I love her, no
Do I have a crush on her, no
but I am amused by her, feel some affection for her, and enjoy her company
Anyway
In a recent discussion, she told me that she has herpes
and out of respect for her privacy I will not get into details beyond saying that in my opinion,
her contracting the virus was due to the malicious neglect of another rather than her own carelessness
We had a really great conversation about it, She was quite open and willing to answer a barrage of questions which came to my mind and for the purposes of the question I am going to put to you, it is also important that I say that she is quite responsible about being aware of her condition, and educating herself on the risks and circumstances and beyond that takes the responsibility to communicated proactively with potential partners.
i.e. she is being responsible in dealing with her situation and moving on with her life
and that I respect a lot, for too many people fail that test.
so after talking with her, I thought about it quite a bit and tried to imagine how that would affect me.
I have always been fairly terrified of STDs, I have been tested every six months since I was 14
so my first thoughts were fairly centered on how contracting such a virus would affect me
I have never even had a cold sore, let alone any other STD
hell, I haven't had mono, pink eye or almost any communicable condition
save chicken pox
I have pretty much always been absolutely healthy
and stayed away from anyone who could give me anything beyond
the common cold or a case of the flu
but then it occurred to me
What would I do if faced with the following situation:
A woman I meet, whom I am highly attracted to and who I greatly respect, a woman who appears to meet my criteria but who informs me she has herpes.
These days herpes is a highly manageable condition, in fact it is theoretically possible to have a relationship with a carrier
without contracting the virus, provided both people are proactive and aware
but theory, risk and reality are very different markers
but what about risk, I take risks all the time, and have often risked life and limb for far less lofty a concept as love
I like to tell myself they are calculated risks, but would this not also be calculated?
and am I lying to myself anyway trying to convince myself that my calculated risks are any less risky?
My first thought was perhaps the risk is worth is for love but not for lust or perhaps a better way to phrase it
would be I wouldn't sleep with a carrier just to get laid but that if marriage was a potential, I wouldn't throw the babe out with the bath water
because if I am never going to have sex with someone else the question of such a disease is fairly moot
really with something like herpes what are the effects
the symptoms are manageable and the primary disruptions to your life
are with potentially infecting someone else and the social stigma attracted to it
if you were married neither would matter much
the next question which came up was of premarital sex if you have sex with a carrier before you are married
how is that any different than sex for lust after all, intending to get married and getting married are two different things
so that lead me to a position of no premarital sex
but still not throwing the baby out with the bath water
I mean if this person is someone I could have a meaningful life with
a person who shares my values and perspectives on things
how much does something like herpes weigh in on that question
in a married situation it seems to hardly matter
in a single situation it seems to weigh quite heavily
of course the idea of getting married without having sex first
seems a little antiquated for me
but then we move to the question of divorce
while I have no intention of getting divorced
I would be a fool not to realize that it is always a possibility
our society's divorces rates are too high to dismiss so casually
especially considering one is risking a permanent condition
and even if you discard divorce
there is always the possibility that your spouse might die
the question comes down to weight
what weighs more
the chance that you might have a loving and wonderful relationship for the rest of your life
or
the chance that you might at some point be single and with a communicable disease
Part of me, wants to say, it depends on the girl
the romantic in me wants to say that for the right woman
I would throw my cares away and conquer the world
and in many ways that is true
the cynic in me however is never silent
it put the weight in the other corner
and
reminds me that I do not think my pride could handle
having to explain to a person who I was romantically interested
that I had a communicable disease
It is one of those choices
where when I try on either position
to see how it feels
neither feels entirely comfortable
I can not abide the idea that I would let such a woman slip through my fingers for anything unrelated to who she is
but at the same time, I am not sure I could be comfortable with the risks either
I suppose what it comes down to is that it is one of those choices
which we are unable to make until we are actually in the situation
so I guess I will have to let this dentate lie unresolved
unless a situation occurs where I have to find a peace with it
If you have gotten this far, I applaud your stamina and ask you
What would you do?
How would you approach such a situation?
I debated making a post about this for some time
partly because it was so abstract but I figured how I approach such a question
says as much about me as whatever answer I do or do not find
and that approach, that process is as much what I am sharing here as anything else
Lastly, a select few of your may have the ability to discern the identity of the person in question,
by piecing together other pieces of information which I have shared with you.
Out of respect for their privacy, and considering this post is not really about them,
even though they sparked the many of the thoughts I would appreciate your discretion as to their identity.
and that's my nickel
use it as you see fit
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
no subject
Date: 2004-02-06 02:33 pm (UTC)Like you I think much would depend on the woman and the relationship. So now that I blathered on.....
I would probably take the risk, take all the precautions and commit myself to the relationship figuring that:
IF despite my precautions I contracted the disease and
IF I somehow ended up back in the dating pool
I was still honest to myself and the love that I had for the person. And in the future (again if) you get to the point that you are now in her shoes, that the person you are dealing with will handle it with the maturity and sensitivity you've shown.
no subject
Date: 2004-02-06 02:50 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-02-06 03:12 pm (UTC)but, i did want to thank you for your eloquence in describing your feelings towards people with whom you don't have any romantic attraction but yet still love. i've found that to be a hard concept for others in my group to grasp recently.
no subject
Date: 2004-02-06 03:25 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-02-06 03:42 pm (UTC)I have better taste than that
it was the twins
I just trying to be obtuse
no subject
Date: 2004-02-06 04:06 pm (UTC)but I think your response is quite right on
I have a tendancy to think too much in "what if" even though I rarely let them bog me down in action
I think that is much because of the difference between pondering situations you are not in, and dealing with those we are, in the best manner we can.
Re:
Date: 2004-02-06 04:07 pm (UTC)rather puts things into perspective
of course
it comes to mind
that I would hope to beat the odds
with regards to knocking em up
multiple times with any woman I marry
no subject
Date: 2004-02-06 05:41 pm (UTC)So, looking back, I wonder if perhaps I was just lucky...but I don't think so. I think we were just careful. But there is a risk, and it has to be approached realistically.
no subject
Date: 2004-02-06 05:56 pm (UTC)This is such a difficult one, dearest.
My ex partener contracted herpes shortly after we split up. It killed me inside for sometime that if I would ever want to go back to him, I couldn't.
I don't think I can do it.
I'm too scared of STDs, they're present in my nightmares, and always in the back of my mind when I meet new people, prospective parteners anyway.
But, of course, when I love, I love so strongly, so passionately, that I'm not entirely sure I could walk away from opportunity like that.
nnng.
I'll get back to you on this one.
no subject
Date: 2004-02-06 06:32 pm (UTC)I ofcourse also wondered how I would tell future partners, and since finding out i've had to tell 2. The first didn't mind one bit and claimed to love me regardless but the second broke up with me the day after I told him funnily enough and it's kind of bizarre because he was actually someone I'd slept with before and I was pretty sure that he was the person I contracted it from. Some people sadly have even suggested to me to not tell future partners about my condition and just use protection all the time but it is a part of me I cannot keep hidden mainly because my future partners deserve to know that if my condition was to get worse and prevent me from having children then they ought to know if being with me long term means they might not be able to have children with me. I think they deserve that choice right from the word go.
I can see why you would find it hard to get your head around but I think if the right woman came along then it would become a miniscule problem. Atleast that's how I feel if I met a man who was absolutely everything I've always wanted but found out he had herpes. I would not hold back from trying to have something with him as the possibility of never knowing how good things might've been had I of continued a relationship is to me more scary than possibly contracting herpes or even aids for that matter.
I'm sure not everyone agrees with this but to me love is acceptance and sometime a little dangerous. So yes I think it is a risk I would take and hopefully one that you might consider taking if ever faced in the situation but for now you aren't so don't worry yourself too much over it.
Re:
Date: 2004-02-06 07:39 pm (UTC)Re:
Date: 2004-02-09 07:13 am (UTC)They hardly seem your type either.
no subject
Date: 2004-02-09 09:00 am (UTC)but imagine how many people
it is going to piss off
I couldnt pass it up