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pluralThis is a response to a post in anothers journal, I try to avoid writing novellas in other peoples journals, and as such (and the fact that there is a 4000 character limit on comments) I decided to post it here and instead create links between them
The original post
Let me first say, that I do not presume to know enough about your relationship to offer this commentary based on anything but my own experiences, and that what I say is biased by my own failings, my own pain, and my own regrets. If you feel that something doesn't apply to your relationship, than disregard it freely.
Your behavior and even his which you related is completely irrelevant to the success of your marriage.
However the failure to communicate openly, and the distrust which has spawned from this does.
People often have this misconception that when you are married that you have a right to know everything about your partner.
I personally find this to be unhealthy.
I have skeletons in my closet, which I think even the most loving and forgiving partner would have a hard time relating to the person I am now.
This is because I was a completely different person then, and do not believe I am capable of such acts now.
So what good would divulging that history do either of us.
None but to instill fears and doubts as to who I am, when the data is by now long irrelevant.
The present is ours, the future maybe ours, but the past is mine alone.
My past is exactly that, what I choose to share is my choice alone.
I do not expect someone to divulge their entire history, nor will I agree to divulge mine.
I think it is very important to maintain personal boundaries within the confines of a relationship.
I do however expect complete loyalty in the present and offer nothing less in return.
If you choose to have a journal, and choose to share it with strangers as to get their unbiased reflections, this is a healthy thing.
You have the right not to share it with your husband.
However, I would definitely not advise trying to hide it from your husband.
Let him know that you are keeping a journal, and that he is not welcome to read it.
He will not like the idea, but it is a better alternative than to attempt to hide it from him.
An online journal is no less private in truth than one kept locked in a drawer, it is a private place for you to reflect upon your thoughts, your concerns, without the judgement of people who have biases and different recollections of the experience and most importantly emotional investment in the events.
You can vent your anger and your frustration without hurting the other person.
In fact, the feedback you receive from anonymous strangers can help you put things in perspective.
If he doesn't trust you to do this, then focus on the problem, his lack of trust, not the symptom, your journal.
Trust is given and trust is broken, Trust cannot be earned.
Being that I trust no one completely, not even a woman who I spent almost four years of my life with, nor my parents nor my best friend of 22 years, I am very familiar with trust issues. (I have huge ones)
There are three comments which you made which I would like to revisit...
1) Not that I didn't think he did this anyway -- I continued to spy on him for months afterward, and found nothing.
2) Now, that's not to say he wasn't doing anything, because if anyone knows how to cover his tracks on the 'net, it's my darling husband.
3) I'll never know for sure if he stopped, but he began to act normal and loving again and eventually I just had to force myself to believe he was being truthful, or go crazy/get divorced.
Basically in those three sentences you went through the entire process which your husband needs to tackle. First the investigation, which is actually completely pointless, because as the second line shows, even without proof of guilt, your trust wasn't restored. You had to decide, either to trust him (i.e. give away the trust without proof of deserved ness) or suffer insanity/divorce.
It is impossible to prove a future negative....
You can not prove that you would not do something, in fact you can barely prove that you have not done something....
If you or your husband want the other to prove that they are being faithful and will always be faithful, you will be sorely disappointed.
It is simply to easy to hide evidence to ever truly allay suspicion.
You are no more likely to have an affair with on the Internet than someone at your office.
Honestly, If I wanted to get away with an affair, I would not let the Internet have anything to do with it, after all everything that travels over the Internet is retained somewhere.
My ex, was obsessed with the idea that I was cheating on her, or even worse, that I would cheat on her. Of course, this was from the same person who cheated on me more than once. To this day, or at least the last time we discussed it, she claims that since nothing really happened (i.e. they didn't have sex supposedly) that is doesn't count as cheating.
I do not believe in secrets however, In the long term, in any serious relationship, there are no secrets, you can hide all proof of infidelity, but you cant hide the change which happens in you.
In one situation, I was out of town, according to her story, she went to a strangers house (whom she had met at a cafe the night before), drank wine, napped on his bed with him, but when he tried to kiss her decided that she wasn't comfortable with the situation and left. Now even if I take her story at face value, which I don't, To me this is cheating. What hurt me more than their supposed actions was their email correspondence, the flighty way she talked about how he made her feel.
As such was the terminating event for our relationship. Had this been the first inappropriate encounter, I might have been able to overlook it. I cant actually believe I just said that. Damn there are times I hate the weakness love brings into my heart.
I have always held, that infidelity is a conscious decision to terminate the relationship. I believe strongly that physical and emotional infidelity are equally grave violations. Before her, I was only aware of one person that cheated on me, and I immediately terminated the relationship, I didn't get angry, didn't yell or scream, I just walked away..
She had the distinction of being one of two people I can say that I truly loved unconditionally. (the first was taken from me in an accident) The bitch about unconditional love is that even when they break your heart, you still love them. I am even more ashamed to admit that even though I say it was her final infidelity that ended the relationship, It was not like I said "that is enough" and broke it off. I was still trying to work things out, although it became quickly obvious to both of us, when she refused even to label it as "inappropriate" rather than cheating, that our loving relationship had been over for quite some time.
I believe the most important standard by which one should determine ones actions is simply this:
"at the end of the day, can you look at yourself in the mirror, and respect your decisions?"
I let my love for her take this from me, and I hope I will never repeat the error.
Deal with the underlying issue, the lack of trust between you, not with behaviors which arouse suspicion.
Even if you truly halt all behaviors which your spouse finds suspicious, either they will think you have become more devious at hiding them, or suspect other behaviors of complicity.
It comes down to this.. either your spouse believes that you honor and hold dear the commitments you made to each other, or they don't.
If they don't, either you can find a way to overcome this mistrust, or you end the relationship.
In the course of my relationship, when faced with hard decisions, I too often choose cowardice, choose to agree with things I knew I didn't believe, and I was unwilling to follow-through on, to save the love that I had.
I can not express what a huge mistake this was.
I lived in a relationship where trust became non-existent, it is not a pretty place.
We reached a point where there was no recovery.
We made the mistake of addressing the symptoms superficially and not the underlying cause.
We ruined what we had out of pride and cowardice, and the pain in my soul because of it has not eased.
I failed, I regret it every waking moment.
I pray that no one else follows in my footsteps....
The original post
Let me first say, that I do not presume to know enough about your relationship to offer this commentary based on anything but my own experiences, and that what I say is biased by my own failings, my own pain, and my own regrets. If you feel that something doesn't apply to your relationship, than disregard it freely.
Your behavior and even his which you related is completely irrelevant to the success of your marriage.
However the failure to communicate openly, and the distrust which has spawned from this does.
People often have this misconception that when you are married that you have a right to know everything about your partner.
I personally find this to be unhealthy.
I have skeletons in my closet, which I think even the most loving and forgiving partner would have a hard time relating to the person I am now.
This is because I was a completely different person then, and do not believe I am capable of such acts now.
So what good would divulging that history do either of us.
None but to instill fears and doubts as to who I am, when the data is by now long irrelevant.
The present is ours, the future maybe ours, but the past is mine alone.
My past is exactly that, what I choose to share is my choice alone.
I do not expect someone to divulge their entire history, nor will I agree to divulge mine.
I think it is very important to maintain personal boundaries within the confines of a relationship.
I do however expect complete loyalty in the present and offer nothing less in return.
If you choose to have a journal, and choose to share it with strangers as to get their unbiased reflections, this is a healthy thing.
You have the right not to share it with your husband.
However, I would definitely not advise trying to hide it from your husband.
Let him know that you are keeping a journal, and that he is not welcome to read it.
He will not like the idea, but it is a better alternative than to attempt to hide it from him.
An online journal is no less private in truth than one kept locked in a drawer, it is a private place for you to reflect upon your thoughts, your concerns, without the judgement of people who have biases and different recollections of the experience and most importantly emotional investment in the events.
You can vent your anger and your frustration without hurting the other person.
In fact, the feedback you receive from anonymous strangers can help you put things in perspective.
If he doesn't trust you to do this, then focus on the problem, his lack of trust, not the symptom, your journal.
Trust is given and trust is broken, Trust cannot be earned.
Being that I trust no one completely, not even a woman who I spent almost four years of my life with, nor my parents nor my best friend of 22 years, I am very familiar with trust issues. (I have huge ones)
There are three comments which you made which I would like to revisit...
1) Not that I didn't think he did this anyway -- I continued to spy on him for months afterward, and found nothing.
2) Now, that's not to say he wasn't doing anything, because if anyone knows how to cover his tracks on the 'net, it's my darling husband.
3) I'll never know for sure if he stopped, but he began to act normal and loving again and eventually I just had to force myself to believe he was being truthful, or go crazy/get divorced.
Basically in those three sentences you went through the entire process which your husband needs to tackle. First the investigation, which is actually completely pointless, because as the second line shows, even without proof of guilt, your trust wasn't restored. You had to decide, either to trust him (i.e. give away the trust without proof of deserved ness) or suffer insanity/divorce.
It is impossible to prove a future negative....
You can not prove that you would not do something, in fact you can barely prove that you have not done something....
If you or your husband want the other to prove that they are being faithful and will always be faithful, you will be sorely disappointed.
It is simply to easy to hide evidence to ever truly allay suspicion.
You are no more likely to have an affair with on the Internet than someone at your office.
Honestly, If I wanted to get away with an affair, I would not let the Internet have anything to do with it, after all everything that travels over the Internet is retained somewhere.
My ex, was obsessed with the idea that I was cheating on her, or even worse, that I would cheat on her. Of course, this was from the same person who cheated on me more than once. To this day, or at least the last time we discussed it, she claims that since nothing really happened (i.e. they didn't have sex supposedly) that is doesn't count as cheating.
I do not believe in secrets however, In the long term, in any serious relationship, there are no secrets, you can hide all proof of infidelity, but you cant hide the change which happens in you.
In one situation, I was out of town, according to her story, she went to a strangers house (whom she had met at a cafe the night before), drank wine, napped on his bed with him, but when he tried to kiss her decided that she wasn't comfortable with the situation and left. Now even if I take her story at face value, which I don't, To me this is cheating. What hurt me more than their supposed actions was their email correspondence, the flighty way she talked about how he made her feel.
As such was the terminating event for our relationship. Had this been the first inappropriate encounter, I might have been able to overlook it. I cant actually believe I just said that. Damn there are times I hate the weakness love brings into my heart.
I have always held, that infidelity is a conscious decision to terminate the relationship. I believe strongly that physical and emotional infidelity are equally grave violations. Before her, I was only aware of one person that cheated on me, and I immediately terminated the relationship, I didn't get angry, didn't yell or scream, I just walked away..
She had the distinction of being one of two people I can say that I truly loved unconditionally. (the first was taken from me in an accident) The bitch about unconditional love is that even when they break your heart, you still love them. I am even more ashamed to admit that even though I say it was her final infidelity that ended the relationship, It was not like I said "that is enough" and broke it off. I was still trying to work things out, although it became quickly obvious to both of us, when she refused even to label it as "inappropriate" rather than cheating, that our loving relationship had been over for quite some time.
I believe the most important standard by which one should determine ones actions is simply this:
"at the end of the day, can you look at yourself in the mirror, and respect your decisions?"
I let my love for her take this from me, and I hope I will never repeat the error.
Deal with the underlying issue, the lack of trust between you, not with behaviors which arouse suspicion.
Even if you truly halt all behaviors which your spouse finds suspicious, either they will think you have become more devious at hiding them, or suspect other behaviors of complicity.
It comes down to this.. either your spouse believes that you honor and hold dear the commitments you made to each other, or they don't.
If they don't, either you can find a way to overcome this mistrust, or you end the relationship.
In the course of my relationship, when faced with hard decisions, I too often choose cowardice, choose to agree with things I knew I didn't believe, and I was unwilling to follow-through on, to save the love that I had.
I can not express what a huge mistake this was.
I lived in a relationship where trust became non-existent, it is not a pretty place.
We reached a point where there was no recovery.
We made the mistake of addressing the symptoms superficially and not the underlying cause.
We ruined what we had out of pride and cowardice, and the pain in my soul because of it has not eased.
I failed, I regret it every waking moment.
I pray that no one else follows in my footsteps....
